I told you so....

[Stonehenge]

About 3 years ago I wrote a letter to a business in the area, telling them that while I loved the limestone retaining wall in fron of their offices, it was destined for failure.

I explained why, and how we might rebuild a wall like that. Never heard from them.

Well, today I was driving by on the way to an appointment....

[Stonehenge]

So, what might you charge for a total tear down and rebuild of a 400 face foot wall like this? Very high visibility, if that makes a dif.

[Lanelle]

We don't have limestone walls here. Its a bit hard to tell in the photo but was the wall retaining anything? Also, it looks as though there wasn't any drainage stone behind the wall?

[Stonehenge]

This pic may help explain...

[Stonehenge]

Drainage stone? We don't need no stinkin' drainage stone! I looked like there may have been scraps of stone behind the wall, but nothing of any noteworthiness.

Three years ago the soil was almost to the top of the wall on the back side of the wall, but with each winter the wall leaned more and more.

I don't know that the exact material is important for price of reconstruction, just something similar, with all wall materials (except what goes behind it) already on site.

[diginahole]

Can the wall be moved ahead? Do you need to excavate and haul away the soils behind the wall? Is it 24" high the whole length?

My first guess (only a guess) 9 or 10K.

[Stonehenge]

Dunno - I have not had any contact with anyone about the project, other than my photos this evening. This will be more a matter of me getting an audience re: the rebuild.

As for the height, it varies, with a height of approx. 1' at each end, quickly working up to a height of 2', and cresting at around 2'3"...avg is about 2'.

[Bexter]

How many hours do you figure for the teardown-rebuild ... 120-150?
Digin's question was a good one because that would make the job go much faster.

[Rex Mann]

Jeff,

Always dislike doing repairs/rebuilds of others work. Always seems like more people see you doing that then any other job. Problem is they might think you did it in the first place! I charge the same for rebuilds as I do from scratch. This job would be no different. I really do not want this type of work but, if your willing to pay me then I'll tackle it.

With this wall, I would try to move it up and save your crew some hours, as some other members suggested. Also, install clear aggregate for drainage along with a drain tile. One last thing, could you batter the wall back? It looks like there might be some jumpers in there, which would not allow that with the current design. O' yeah, I'd use fabric under and behind this wall too.

Peace,

Rex

[Stonehenge]

Rex - that was part of my pitch when I sent this outfit a letter a few years ago - the wall started with no batter, and there was no drainage stone behind it (other than little scraps).

I would plan on wrapping the drainage stone in an envelope of fabric, with drain tile at the bottom (above front face final grade) daylighting in a few places to expedite draining.

Moving the wall ahead a few feet would likely not be a problem as there's nothing in front of it but turf, and no obstacles I could see.

You hit on one of my fears - people would think we screwed it up the first time...Maybe I could fab a sign - "We're repairing someone else's work". :) Maybe not.

What's a 'jumper'?

Bexter, I was thinking 150 might be the minimum # of man-hours, given my current staff. Might be more like 150-180.

[Paul]

This type of failure is common with no batter walls, soil wasn't compacted behind the wall. a complete rebuild is not nessary, the first course should still be goodstart at one end tearing down then rebuild as you go with batter, pipe and gravel. The last 6" of fill should be good clay compacted to form a water restant cap.

[Bexter]

I know this has been hashed out before but I saw it mentioned a couple of times in this thread ... the use of Fabric behind the wall.
This probably deserves a thread of its own … I would have to disagree.

[Paul]

Fabric behind walls????.......... We do it at times, mostly do to soils behind the walls and what type of water they will hold. On rivers we use fabric behind our walls but we also install much more gravel. Around here rivers have heavy silt that can clog up some fabrics so most non woven fabrics won't work. We want the smaller fines to move thru the fabric and into the washed gravel, the river will carry these away in a natural stone wall. On other walls we don't , they should have a natural clay soils that don't hold water keeping the gravel back fill clear. That is as long as you follow the rule of capping the wall with a clay cap. In other areas of the country (those who have higher sand content) I would use a fabric.

[Rex Mann]

Fabric behind this wall is to prevent the unsightliness of soil leaching though the face.

Peace,

Rex

[Rex Mann]

A jumper is a piece of a wall system, which can be placed vertically. These pieces are mostly 2-courses high. It allows for a more random look.

Peace,

Rex

[Bexter]

Yes I agree with using it between the soil and the infill area....

What I believe is that the fabric (by becoming clogged) could cause the infill area to become saturated and will increase the hydrostatic pressure.... could cause big problems.

[Stonehenge]

That's interesting...I've sat on both sides of the fence on this issue. And sometimes on it. :doh:

I really liked Paul's explanation of using the clay cap to help prevent water from even entering the system.