Raised patio design help

[anon]

I am looking to get a simple rectangular 2-level raised patio installed in the backyard of my house - new contruction. I would like the 2 levels to vary along the length of the house.
The grade is pretty much all flat and the kitchen french door is about 24" above grade.
I want the size of the patio to be about 38' (along the house dimension) x 15' .
Ideally I would like to step out from the kitchen french doors on to the patio (maybe about a 6" step down).
I would like half of the patio (19'x15') to be at this level and the other half of the patio another 12" below this level with 1 step (2 risers) between the 2 levels.

What is the best way to do this.
1)Build perimeter walls up from below grade , fill the center with compacted base and install pavers.
(or)
2) As suggested by a local landscaping company, build a berm along the perimter of the patio to save on wall costs and fill the inside with compacted based and install pavers.

Thanks in advance for the advice.

[Fine Edge]

I would keep Door #2 closed and open up Door #1.
It sounds like this is going to be a decent sized project and , if done properly, will add value to your home. We build all of our raised patios with the proper wall size and would never think about trying to add a berm to build upon, especially at 18" - 24" above grade. Seems like a major instability issue in the coming years.
Plus, at 38' long, I would imagine you would probably want a set of steps near both ends and I just can't envision a 2' high raised patio with a set of steps stuck into the berm.

Keep us updated!

[anon]

That is exactly what I thought. But this local landscaping company is pretty big (I saw at least 8-10 trucks in their office lot) and I am not exactly a landscaping expert.

If you are going to build a 2' raised patio on completely flat grade I would have thought you would need stone walls all around instead of walls made of packed soil (berms).

[Hamons]

What you may find - I know its true in my area - is that the biggest companies are NOT the highest end companies. Bigger companies ten to service low profit - igh volume accounts and smaller ones can focus on high end jobs.

[Raj Venugopal]

Post some pictures.

Picture's worth a thousand words.

Depending your location, perhaps a GTX professional is in your neighbourhood!

[Fine Edge]

Don't be fooled by the 10 trucks and 40 guys. From my standpoint, it doesn't mean anything except that they must have their hands extremely busy to keep that many people working.
I try to analyze ( not necessarily criticize ) all other service businesses that we come across as we are working and I have come to a basic conclusion:

The service industry in this country stinks!!! It's always go - go - go for me too but I still make the time to do it right.

[agla]

I would be much more concerned with what is happening along the 38' of the house than whether it is sloped away or walled along the outer edge.

Do you have a plan to keep your siding and sill from rotting and to not have a termite express route?

[anon]

The idea to have the patio level 2" below the sill.
Siding is all brick and Sill is stone.

I was thinking of using some sort of a water barrier between the house and the concrete base fo rthe patio.

[agla]

"Ideally I would like to step out from the kitchen french doors on to the patio (maybe about a 6" step down)."

This was the source of my concern.

[anon]

Sorry Agla for sounding dumb.

What is the concern here? Is the 6" drop too deep?

[agla]

The concern was that I assumed conventional framing which would have about 12" of wood between the floor and the top of foundation and then most building codes require 8" between the wood and surrounding grade.

Your situation is obviously different.

[anon]

Agla,
I still dont get what you are saying.
I am attaching a picture of the home and outlined the 2 level patio I would ideally like to have. Hope this would clarify things.

[AZTLANLC]

That is a nice house.
I can't tell from the pictures where the fundation starts or stops.
But if it were my house I would rather have couple of steps in front of the door and make a big patio all at the same elevation.
Unless that step down has a special purpose like a hot tub.

[agla]

I have some confusion because I thought that anon replied to me about it being a brick house on a granite sill, but now I don't see that reply and it does not show up as a private message in my box.

Obviously I have confused two posts.

My concern about the patio against conventional framing remains. This is not a good situation for a homeowner. I would also suggest that It is wiser to have steps down to the patio and not risk damage to such a large length of the house.

What is the preparation that has been done along the sill and foundation? Was it done by a professional?

[GLAN]

What about deck from french doors to the left.....stairs down to a nice paver patio?






Jacuzzi in there some where :)

[anon]

I should have explained the house more clearly, sorry. The house does not have a basement and is on crawl space. The left half of the house is 2' above grade. The right half of the house is almost at grade. You can see 2 different sill levels in the picture. The sill level on the left side of the house is at the inside floor level.
The sill below the big windows on the right side of the picture is approx 1' above the inside floor level, i.e. the bottom of those big windows is about 1' from the inside floor level.


I suppose I could have a deck. I just like the stone patio look.

I am conused about "damage to the house"; "patio against conventional framing" remarks above. The lateral forces from the patio along the length of the house are going to be on the brick wall. What woudl that have to do with the framing.

I suppose I could also have steps going down from the french door to a single level patio at or slightly above grade.
Ideally I would love to step out of the
kitchen on the patio instead of taking 2-3 steps down. Easier to carry stuff in and out.

[agla]

Conventional framing is a foundation (poured concrete or concrete masonry units also known as 8" block - maybe what you are calling a brick?) with a wood sill plate with floor joists sitting on top of it and a band joist going around the outside of it, and plywood subflooring over all of that. This would mean about 12" of wood making up the difference between the foundation and the floor of the house. This would be the same whether it is a basement or a crawl space.

It sounds like you have masonry right up to the threshold of your door. If that is the case, you do not have conventional framing, so don't worry about it.

[GLAN]

I know that the deck may seem like settling.....



But it's a great option.....French doors is the kitchen.......correct?

So then deck off those doors and go left along the house.......You'd probably want the BBQ within reasonable distance of the kitchen.......BBQ goes up there.....along with a round table or rectangle, umbrella, chairs, pots of flowers and other stuff.

The lower paver patio area, which I am guessing along the side of the house is where you would have a walkway from the front to the back?..........If so........paver the patio and walk out to the front......The patio area gets the moveable fire pit, maybe whicker type furniture......like a lounge area.


Coinsidentaly.......that is what I did......except reverse. I already had the deck.......many moons ago I install a natural stone patio.

And I have a Jacuzzi tucked in next to the steps for the deck.

I have been meaning to take pics..........running out of time. So let me try and do that this weekend.

[Fine Edge]

IT looks like conventional framing to me and I think what agla is concerned about is the 12" of wood framing below the door that may be subject to water damage with a raised patio flush to the bottom of the door. Even though there is brick on the outside, the inside of the brick / block is still lumber.
If you decide to go the route that you mentioned, waterproofing against the house should be mandatory, and then again between the wall that will need to be built against the house and any fill required.

[agla]

Yes, Fine Edge has explained my concern a lot more clearly. Thank you FE.

[Fine Edge]

Agla, I'm just sad to see my tree removed from your MOQ logo!
( Or should I say YOUR tree)!!!!

[agla]

I was cut down in my prime!

[ckcland]

Question 1: where is the back door located? Just off to the right I am guessing.

I like the idea of keeping the patio at current ground level and spend the savings form raising the patio and incorporate sitting walls and columns ( and lighting of course!)

what area are you in?

[Brenna]

I am also building a raised patio with a design similar to Anon's. We have french doors that create a "bump" out. We plan to create 3 stairs onto a raised patio that will continue to circle out to the left (if you're walking down the stairs from the french doors). This area will hold the table and grill. Then to the left, we would like to add a few more long stairs from the raised patio to go to another level that's flush with the grass. This will hold a 10x10 patio and a fire pit. This will also circle out wider to the right of the house. We are having a problem figuring out how to connect the stairs to the bump out since it is open beneath. I have attached a picture. I could use recommendations on how to solve this problem. Also, if you think our design could use some help, I would really appreciate suggestions on that as well. Thanks in advance.

[Stonehenge]

You may need to pour a slab with frost footings beneath it for your steps. If they will be made from brick and block, they shouldn't be attached to the house, unless those footings are in place.